View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
chad_fross
Joined: 02 Feb 2007 Posts: 37 Location: Seoul Korea
|
Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 6:33 am Post subject: bag leather and rivet/grommet sources??? |
|
|
I have notice a few pics of rivetted bags on here. I am very interested in making rivetted bags. As I have just completed my first sackpipa (only the wooden parts, minus the mouthpiece) I am in search of a source of bag leather and the proper rivets and tools needed to rivet the bag. If any of you who have made these rivetted bags could tell me where you purchased your leather and rivets, I would great appreciate it
Chad _________________ Chad |
|
Back to top |
|
|
texasbagpiper Senior User
Joined: 24 Oct 2006 Posts: 352 Location: Texas
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
chad_fross
Joined: 02 Feb 2007 Posts: 37 Location: Seoul Korea
|
Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:32 am Post subject: tandy leather |
|
|
Thanks Seth,
I just looked at Tandy leather online, they have everything. But they have so many different types and cuts and sizes and weights of leather that I don't know which one I should choose? Splits, bends, sides, 3 ounce, 4 ounce 6 ounce...........which is best suited, which cut/type/weight/ and size dimensions do you order to make bags? Also, the rivets that they have, which length should I use to make the bag?
I don't want to order rivets that have shanks which are too short or two long.
Thanks again Seth,
Chad _________________ Chad |
|
Back to top |
|
|
texasbagpiper Senior User
Joined: 24 Oct 2006 Posts: 352 Location: Texas
|
Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 4:16 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I use the shortest rivets they sell... As far as the leather I think its just tanned calf hide used for chaps... I have a tandy nearby so I pick mine out by hand so I can do the suck test on the leather to make sure its not too porous.... Seth |
|
Back to top |
|
|
favrepipes
Joined: 26 Oct 2006 Posts: 63 Location: Vancouver
|
Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 11:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hi Chad,
The best way to buy leather is to go directly to the supplier and test it for airtightness, as well as to inspect it for any imperfections on the surface. I realize that you may not be in an area that supplies such leather in which case you are relying on tried and trusted sources. I have used Tandy motorcycle chap sides and they seem reliable. While the leather itself is generally staunch, it is not as supple as some of the pipe bags that I've encountered. They usually don't sell less than a side which costs anywhere from $120-200 US. As for weight, 3.5-4 oz is what I generally seek out.
I had a long talk about tanning processes and origins of leather with a seller and apparently the recipe used has a lot to do with airtightness and life span. He informed me that even the same recipe doesn't guarantee that the result will always be equal. This is why testing it personnally is the better way to go if you can.
Best,
Bo |
|
Back to top |
|
|
chad_fross
Joined: 02 Feb 2007 Posts: 37 Location: Seoul Korea
|
Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 1:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks Bo and Seth. I really don't have any way to get to a tandy dealer. I wish I could, but I'm literally half a world away from any tandy leather place. I don't suppose I could prosition someone to take money from me next time they go shopping for leather? Maybe pick up a side for me? I'll of course pay for shipping. Any takers? or too risky?
Thanks again gentlemen.
Or on the other hand.........maybe it would be more cost effective right now for me (I'm sure a side is not exactly light) as I don't need a whole lot of bags right now...........maybe I could commision someone to make a few bags for me.......say maybe 2 or 3 bags for now? I don't really care if they are rivetted or stitched. As long as they hold air.
Anyone interested in making a few bags for me, let me know through email if you can do it, and "wages" you would require for the effort.
Chad _________________ Chad |
|
Back to top |
|
|
JNelson
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 19 Location: move around, Florida, Alaska, Texas, Kenya
|
Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2007 12:50 am Post subject: pelts |
|
|
does anyone have experience using a strait up pelt for a bag?
I am considering making a "floor bag" for the guys at school to play at intramural games. I want to make it as obnoxious and fun as possible. I am considering making the thing out of a raccoon pelt and leave the fur outside with the tail hanging down the back. any advice? _________________ Jonathan Nelson |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Yuri Senior User
Joined: 16 Dec 2006 Posts: 149 Location: New Zealand
|
Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2007 6:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
Thing about hair out sort of bags is that they tend to be a bit more difficult to hold than hair in. A lot of E.European folk pipes use the entire skin of an animal, but rather few are left with the hair showing. I never tried them myself, but by what I read, they tend to be a bit slippery.
Mind you, that's what I read about using leather with the shiny side out, and my last bag is made just like that (I got sick of the really dirty appearance of my previous one, so made one with the shiny one showing), and it works fine. No slippage.
In any case, try to use a male one, as female pelts have a couple of rows of nipples, and they leak air. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Olle Site Admin
Joined: 21 Oct 2006 Posts: 435 Location: Uppsala, Sweden
|
Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2007 9:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
Here is an old picture of Jan "Liraman" Winter and me, with my Macedonian Gajda.
.
Note that even the head is still attached.
I can confirm that it is somewhat slippery to play. It is also a very big bag - takes a lot of effort just to fill it up. _________________ Info on Swedish bagpipes at http://olle.gallmo.se/sackpipa
More about me at http://olle.gallmo.se |
|
Back to top |
|
|
JNelson
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 19 Location: move around, Florida, Alaska, Texas, Kenya
|
Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 1:19 am Post subject: coon bag |
|
|
Thanks for the advice, maybe I will put a miniture floor jersey on the bag to help with the slipping. Hey Olle, I want to keep the head intact with the chanter coming out of the mouth of the raccoon, but I am not sure how to do that with all the holes in the head, eyes ears ect. how does your Gajda address this issue? _________________ Jonathan Nelson |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Yuri Senior User
Joined: 16 Dec 2006 Posts: 149 Location: New Zealand
|
Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 6:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'd turn a proper stock, and carve the upper suface to receive the top half of the scull, sort of sawn off somewhere across the mid-line. (carefully, since they tend to be rather brittle. That means a fine blade, too)
You can stick the lower jaw onto the underside, too.
Olle? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
JNelson
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 19 Location: move around, Florida, Alaska, Texas, Kenya
|
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
hhmm,
I have the pelt but not the skull, I was considering adding shape to the head by inserting something later... should I make the stock extra long to reach out the mouth and then tie it into the neck? I was thinking of adding foam insulation or something to give the head shape. great stuff comes to mind, it expands pretty well, probably make a way for the stock to be removed without interfering with the foam. let me know if anyone else has any other ideas. _________________ Jonathan Nelson |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Yuri Senior User
Joined: 16 Dec 2006 Posts: 149 Location: New Zealand
|
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 7:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
You know, I didn't quite get that. And I rather suspect that Swedish-speakers got it even less. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Olle Site Admin
Joined: 21 Oct 2006 Posts: 435 Location: Uppsala, Sweden
|
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Quote: | I'd turn a proper stock, and carve the upper suface to receive the top half of the scull, sort of sawn off somewhere across the mid-line. (carefully, since they tend to be rather brittle. That means a fine blade, too) |
I suspect that is how my Gajda was made. Possibly it is all wood (but, if so, it is a a very good replica of the original bone structure). _________________ Info on Swedish bagpipes at http://olle.gallmo.se/sackpipa
More about me at http://olle.gallmo.se |
|
Back to top |
|
|
JNelson
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 19 Location: move around, Florida, Alaska, Texas, Kenya
|
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 9:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
ok thanks, I guess I'll make due without the skull and just shape the stock to be extra long and tie into the neck. sorry for the confusion. "Great Stuff" is a spray foam used for filling gaps and insulating windows. it expands as it drys. If I sprayed some inside the head of the raccoon after I have installed the stock, it would expand and push the face out into it's proper shape as it dries. it's lighter weight than the original skull but may end up looking messier. _________________ Jonathan Nelson |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Yuri Senior User
Joined: 16 Dec 2006 Posts: 149 Location: New Zealand
|
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 11:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Ah, now it's clear.
What I'd do is this: plug up the neck behind where the head part stops. (around where the vertebraes would start.) Then fill the head part with the stuff, as you wrote. (I suspect it's something like polyurethan foam, they use that ifn filling boat compartments, so they don't sink even if scuttled.) Then, when the foam set, drill or cut a hole into it that will receive the wooden stock. This way it's more manageable and predictable. You probably can also mold the head around the foam more easily. You'll need an opening somewhere else to get the plug out, of course. If you already sewn up the back, it's probably too late for this way, unless you just tied it up. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
JNelson
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 19 Location: move around, Florida, Alaska, Texas, Kenya
|
Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 8:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Yeah, I'm thinking I will just make a plug for the back side and tie that in rather than sew it up. _________________ Jonathan Nelson |
|
Back to top |
|
|
JNelson
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 19 Location: move around, Florida, Alaska, Texas, Kenya
|
Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2007 6:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I tied everything in last night and tried out some reeds I had lying around. I added an extra drone and soon found that I had a whole lot less air than I thought I had, so I will probably be sewing in an extra length of leather along the stomach to add some volume to the bag. I don't know if this will work or not. Should I just take out the extra drone?[/img] _________________ Jonathan Nelson |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Yuri Senior User
Joined: 16 Dec 2006 Posts: 149 Location: New Zealand
|
Posted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 5:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'd check first if the bag is truly airtight. As in plug in the stocks, bow it up and press hard. Then watch what happens. You can add normal bag seasoning to it, since it's hair out , if it needs it. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
JNelson
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 19 Location: move around, Florida, Alaska, Texas, Kenya
|
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 8:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
well, I've ended up doing what I had hoped I wouldn't need to, I'm sewing in an extra strip of leather in the chest and rump area. It should give me a lot more volume of air, as well as give me something more to hold onto, but it greatly increases the complexity of the assembly. next time, I think I'll pay a little more and find a pelt with a bigger girth. probably have to season now that I have the extra seams in the bag. it's been a good experience so far though. _________________ Jonathan Nelson |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Whisteul
Joined: 02 Jul 2007 Posts: 15 Location: Lille, Nord France.
|
Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 11:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
Could someone explain me what's the interest of using rivet-grommet for a bag instead of sewing it ? What are the differences ? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
texasbagpiper Senior User
Joined: 24 Oct 2006 Posts: 352 Location: Texas
|
Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 6:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Whisteul wrote: | Could someone explain me what's the interest of using rivet-grommet for a bag instead of sewing it ? What are the differences ? |
I think riveting is easier than sewing. You punch the holes with a leather punch then put the rivet's in and squeeze them togather with rivet pliers or tap them with a hammer if you don't have the pliers...
I don't mind sewing a bag but I like to stay away from it if at all possible, E.J. Jones taught me to make pipebags( he uses rivets) although its pretty easy if you want to try it yourself, but it helps to have someone help you the first time...
Another thing I've never had a leak from a riveted bag but I have had a leak from a sewn bag through one of the stitches...
Cheers, Seth Hamon
www.hamonbagpipes.com |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|