Norden Sackpipa Association of the Americas (NSAA)

[Mark Walstrom]

Hi, I was fortunate on my first trip to Sweden to meet up with Olle G. in Uppsala . We are lucky to have him leading this forum; wonderful guy and very helpful and knowledgeable. I also visited the Vasa Museum in Stockholm and took these photographs. Olle asked if I would share them on this forum. The museum houses the reconstructed Vasa ship that sunk in the Baltic on it's maiden voyage in 1628. It also has many items (some on loan from other museums) that depict life in Sweden in 1628. The sackpipa on display is on loan from the Stockholm Musicmuseet. I believe it is the same one pictured in Per-Ulf Allmo's book "Sackpipa i Norden" on page 431.





The large Sackpipa player carving (about 3 feet tall) was one of many wooden musician figures adorning an interior cabin, supposedly commisioned by the King because he liked music. It is also pictured in Allmo's book on page 65.
I was very surprised to run into these beautiful things, not knowing they were there on display.

[Nic]

Wow ! Thank's for posting this images, it is so rare to see early instruments, especialy bagpipes !

[Yuri]

Does anyone know what the little drone's relationship to the big one? As in a fifth, octave, or any other?
By the way, is the bag original 17th century?

[Olle]

The small drone is blind (i.e. not drilled through). Just for show. This is the case for all preserved instruments that (seem to) have two drones.

Though the purpose of showing this instrument at the Vasa museum is to show Swedish life in the 17th century, I'm pretty sure it is a 19th century bagpipe.
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[Ian Hutchison]

[Olle]

My own theory is that some pipe makers tried to make instruments with two drones, but when they failed to solve the tuning problems they plugged one of them. And if you have a hole to plug you can just as well use a plug which looks like a drone, for show.
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[Quimbisero]

I haven't been around for a while - work tends to interfere with the important things in life from time to time, but I don't want to be booted either. I was expecting to see millions of posts. Well, maybe I didn't see millions, but a few interesting ones all the same.

Well, I felt like revisiting this old thread because I like to wonder about such matters. Anyway, wondering about the possible origins of the Sackpipa, it occurred to me that if the instrument was the result of some creative Swede imitating an instrument he saw somewhere else, perhaps the second drone was an attempt to imitate the appearance of the original model he remembered, but after making the first drone he said, enough of this, and chucked it. One drone makes you happy, two make you mad?

Eoghan
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[Eliott]

That's a possibility. My personal theory is this: If you look at the size of the hole in the bag itself, the hole (most likely a natural hole from various parts of a sheep/goat's anatomy as many early pipes would've been made from) is a rather large hole. Now, in order to fill it, a wide block of wood could be used, with the extra wood beyond the hole in the bag just used for whatever aesthetic purposes the pipemaker wanted. So, rather than having an abnormally thick drone, making a false drone would fit in well aesthetically and be convenient enough to fit inside of the bag's hole.

[JP WNC]

Since we've entered a wild speculation phase I'll throw in my guess.

Drainage port.

Here's my reasoning: You have an instrument developed in cold times. Houses probably weren't heated well, people may have played outside, etc. When you play an instrument in cold weather you wind up with a LOT more condensation than when it's warm. This was always an amusement when I was in marching band towards the end of the season when it got stupid cold...how big of a lake would be at the bottom of my Sax when I stopped? Trumpet and trombone players would be hitting the "spit" valve like it was a note in the music. So what do you do on a bagpipe? Pull out the chanter? - might damage the reed. Pull out the drone? - reed damage again. Pull out the blowpipe? Might mess up the valve. Build a dedicated drain hole? Sure! Might as well integrate it into the drone stock and make it look good while you're at it.

[pibgyrn]

[Olle]

Yes.
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[pibgyrn]

How many historic examples are there??

[Olle]

13-15 or so, at least 7 of which have a blind extra drone.
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[pibgyrn]

Thanks again, more questions.

Are the stocks blind or could they take a non blind working drone?

Gerard

[Olle]

[pibgyrn]

It would be very interesting to find out, museums here are very keen to help you have access to historical instruments, especially as a maker/ researcher.

Blind stocks would suggest, that they are completely symbolic-

I see your point mentioned above about tuning two drones but I believe if you can make an instrument with a chanter and drone in tune you can make one with two drones in tune, but it does increase the madness..

Regards and thanks for replyng

[Olle]

Yes, but the drones in those days did not have tuning slides. They were all in one piece (as in the picture above). On top of that, they used Phragmites australis reeds - more sensitive to humidity than reeds made from Arundo donax. It must have been difficult just to keep one drone in tune.

Per-Ulf raised another possibility, that the blind drone is a fixed part (an outgrowth, if you will) of the stock, i.e. that they were carved in one piece and that the blind drone is not detachable at all. We'll see.
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Info on Swedish bagpipes at http://olle.gallmo.se/sackpipa
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[pibgyrn]

I take your point, some amount of tuning could be done with a bridle, but lets agree to differ.

If it is a fixed part that would be very interesting.

Thanks Again

[Jason]

Hello,
I was a bit disappointed to learn that the sackpipa at the Vasa museum may not be be a seventeenth century example as Olle suspects though I like it. Does anyone have pictures of any other examples of the sackpipa from centuries past? I would be delighted to see such images.
Thank you,
Jason

[texasbagpiper]

I'm curious as to Sackpipa's that may show up in the future when this instrument becomes more commonly known across the world. No telling whats stashed in old estates, attics, etc. May not be many but their has to be a few. Some people may have parts with no bag and don't know what they have. Could be..... Seth

[Olle]

As long as we're dreaming, a great find would be to encounter one of the three sets which emigrated, together with their owners, to America. It is known that at least three of the old pipers emigrated:

* Erik Persson, in 1868 to Boone, Iowa (with an associated tune - the first track on my CD)
* Hol Brita Larsdotter, in 1868, to Cokato, Minnesota
* Ör Anna Jonsdotter (Brita's mother), in 1880, presumably also to Cokato.

There is a small lake in Minnesota which is named after Brita's family - Skifstrom lake. There is another topic here on the forum about that (http://www.nordenfolk.org/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=1240)
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Info on Swedish bagpipes at http://olle.gallmo.se/sackpipa
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[Black Rose]

It's a small world. I drive through Cokato every month or so.
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